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ApplianceGuru.com: The Samurai Appliance Repair Forums > Do-It-Yourself Appliance Repair Help > The Laundry Appliance Repair Forum > Maytag washer model LAT8714AAE won't spin, agitate or drain |
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| Maytag washer model LAT8714AAE won't spin, agitate or drain | Rate Topic |
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| Posted: Sat Aug 8th, 2009 07:57 pm |
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1st Post |
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TramoreJohn Apprentice Appliantologist, First Class
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The machine will fill up with water, and then nothing. The timer does not move. If I manually rotate the timer to where it should agitate or spin, still nothing. By nothing I mean just that - nothing. No sound as if the motor is working, no other activity whatsoever. I had the timer replaced about 18 months ago when it did a similar thing but the knob kept turning. The machine is probably 15 years old, maybe more. I've meggered the lid switch and lid switch fuse, including disconnecting one side of the switch to ensure no sneak circuit. Both look good. I doublechecked the switch by metering it with the top open and then closed. Got expected behavior. I also metered across Yellow 16 (from the fill switch) and Black 32 on the timer with the knob where it should be agitating and again where it should be spinning and got nothing. According to another thread that should mean the timer is good, but that thread was for a case where the knob would rotate on its own but the machine did nothing, which is NOT my situation. Is there another test for the timer? Is there something else altogether that I should try? I seek enlightenment... John
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| Posted: Sat Aug 8th, 2009 09:09 pm |
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2nd Post |
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kdog Fellow, Academy of Sublime Masters of Appliantology 
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Best do a double take on that lid switch, there are actually 2 switches involved, and failure causes the exact symptoms you describe - RepairClinic part #1468
____________________ Can Ye spare some 'cutter me brutha ? http://web.me.com/zenzoidman/kdog/ |
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| Posted: Sat Aug 8th, 2009 11:49 pm |
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3rd Post |
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RegUS_PatOff Fellow, Academy of Sublime Masters of Appliantology 
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Wiring Diagram on PDF page 161 LAT8714AAE Service Manual
____________________ RegUS_PatOff http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oPAY2LsKVEw my video production: “Easter Seals Walk With Me” (also in HQ) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-EBiLyYXMiA Upon leaving this Earth "Do you want the Smoking or Non-Smoking section ?" |
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| Posted: Sun Aug 9th, 2009 01:43 am |
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4th Post |
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TramoreJohn Apprentice Appliantologist, First Class
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kdog, Wow, thanks for the quick reply. I really don't know much about this but I agree the symptoms sure do sound like a dead lid switch. So I went back and checked again. The fuse checks OK. I pulled all five leads off of the two switches and metered all six combinations of leads (2 on lid switch, 3 on check switch). The lid switch showed continuity when the lid was down and open when the lid was open. The check switch showed continuity on the "outer" pair whether the lid was open or closed. Open on both combinations with the "inner" lead. I assume that is because the out of balance arm is saying it is in balance? Anyway, it looks like the lid switch assembly is not the problem. Maybe I need some specifics for metering the timer? Or perhaps it is something altogther different? For what it is worth, the machine was working fine until it just broke. No symtoms prior to finding this problem. John
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| Posted: Sun Aug 9th, 2009 01:57 am |
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5th Post |
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RegUS_PatOff Fellow, Academy of Sublime Masters of Appliantology
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When the Washer should be running (Wash Cycle, Timer Knob pulled out, Lid Switch activated) check for voltage on the Yellow Wire of the Lid Switch OR from each side of the Timer Motor to a good ground (chassis)
____________________ RegUS_PatOff http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oPAY2LsKVEw my video production: “Easter Seals Walk With Me” (also in HQ) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-EBiLyYXMiA Upon leaving this Earth "Do you want the Smoking or Non-Smoking section ?" |
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| Posted: Sun Aug 9th, 2009 02:10 am |
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6th Post |
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TramoreJohn Apprentice Appliantologist, First Class
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RegUS_PatOff, So now I have to show true ignorance. I understand how to check for continuity. And I understand how to check for voltage at an outlet or such. How do I check for voltage on the yellow wire coming into the lid switch? Don't I need another lead to do the check? Can I just use the ground stud for the wire that grounds the control faceplate to the washer body? Also, When you say "each side of the Timer Motor" I'm not sure exactly what you mean. John
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| Posted: Sun Aug 9th, 2009 02:13 am |
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7th Post |
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RegUS_PatOff Fellow, Academy of Sublime Masters of Appliantology
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yes, the Yellow Wire with one probe, and the other probe on a good ground (almost any screw, etc..) same with the Timer Motor: one probe on one side and the other probe to ground... try again on the other side and one probe to ground.
____________________ RegUS_PatOff http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oPAY2LsKVEw my video production: “Easter Seals Walk With Me” (also in HQ) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-EBiLyYXMiA Upon leaving this Earth "Do you want the Smoking or Non-Smoking section ?" |
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| Posted: Sun Aug 9th, 2009 03:34 am |
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8th Post |
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TramoreJohn Apprentice Appliantologist, First Class
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Great, I'll try the lid switch in the morning. But I'm still not sure what you mean by "each side" of the timer motor. There are two connector blocks that go into the assembly which includes the timer knob. Multiple leads come into each block. Are there specific leads I should check?
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| Posted: Sun Aug 9th, 2009 03:50 am |
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9th Post |
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RegUS_PatOff Fellow, Academy of Sublime Masters of Appliantology
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the Timer Motor are the Black Wires 
____________________ RegUS_PatOff http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oPAY2LsKVEw my video production: “Easter Seals Walk With Me” (also in HQ) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-EBiLyYXMiA Upon leaving this Earth "Do you want the Smoking or Non-Smoking section ?" |
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| Posted: Sun Aug 9th, 2009 04:06 am |
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10th Post |
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kdog Fellow, Academy of Sublime Masters of Appliantology
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TramoreJohn wrote:
Sounds like a failed switch to me
____________________ Can Ye spare some 'cutter me brutha ? http://web.me.com/zenzoidman/kdog/ |
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| Posted: Sun Aug 9th, 2009 04:25 am |
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11th Post |
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RegUS_PatOff Fellow, Academy of Sublime Masters of Appliantology
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kdog wrote: TramoreJohn wrote:... The check switch showed continuity on the "outer" pair whether the lid was open or closed. Open on both combinations with the "inner" lead. "inner & "outer" confusing, but yes, sounds like bad (Check Switch) of Lid Switch... in diagram, bottom connector is common (Red), and should switch between the other (2).. to Yellow when Lid closed to White when Lid open click on picture 
____________________ RegUS_PatOff http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oPAY2LsKVEw my video production: “Easter Seals Walk With Me” (also in HQ) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-EBiLyYXMiA Upon leaving this Earth "Do you want the Smoking or Non-Smoking section ?" |
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| Posted: Sun Aug 9th, 2009 02:49 pm |
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12th Post |
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TramoreJohn Apprentice Appliantologist, First Class
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So I just proved that I am a rank amatuer at this. I'm pretty sure I fried the timer and the lid switch (if it wasn't already bad). But it is a really complicated story. Apoligies in advance for what will be a long post. I re-checked continuity on the check switch with the lid open and closed. Here is what I saw. Lid Closed Y-R = open Y-W = open R-W = continuity Lid Open Y-R = open Y-W = open R-W = continuity Seems like a bad switch, no? So I tried to check the voltage on the timer motor with the machine on. I got zero from both sides to ground. Does that confirm the bad switch? I went to meter the check switch with the power on and in the process of removing the red lead all of a sudden the washer came on and began to spin. The timer knob was set to spin. The timer knob moved and the cycle completed correctly. So I tried to run it through a cycle and nothing happened. No timer movement. No filling of the tub. No agitation. No spinning. I tried moving the timer knob to different settings and still nothing. So I went back to checking for 120V across the switch. I got nothing from Yellow to ground or Red to ground. So I removed the white lead and went to check it. In doing so I shorted it. Got a lovely flash, popping sound and some smoke. The circuit breaker tripped. I unplugged the machine and reset the breaker. Now when I put the timer knob on spin with the power on I got a lovely hum and I could see the motor whirring along. But no timer knob movement. So I put the knob to off, and unplugged the machine. I checked the lid switch fuse and of course it was blown. (Amazingly enough I have two 1A250V fuses in my workshop left over from ancient automobiles or something.) I go back and rechecked the check switch for continuity and get the following. Lid Closed Y-R = continutiy Y-W = open R-W = open Lid Open Y-R = continuity Y-W = open R-W = open Still seems like a bad switch, but now stuck in a different place. Just for grins I plugged in the washer and moved the knob. Now I get nothing. No hum. Nothing. Unplug. Think. Replug in the washwer and now I can get the machine to spin but nothing else. It will not fill. It will not agitate. But as long as I put the knob past the wash time marks I get spinning and it seems to run for the alloted time to spin and then shut itself down. Note that I did not change anything except unplugging and replugging in the washer. Oh, just to make my day I also broke the red plastic on the soak light so that the bulb that hangs off it behind the panel no longer can be attached. I taped it in place as best I could. This doesn't affect function, but is just another minor annoyance. I'm thinking I have a bad lid switch for sure and possibly a bad timer. My thought is to replace the lid switch assembly (including the fuse, of course) and see if that helps. Then move on to the the timer if the lid switch didn't do the trick. Despite the fireworks, I'm confident I can replace these components. But I'm also thinking I don't have the slightest idea of how to troubleshoot a washing machine. Could there be problems with other components like the water level switch, for example. Any enlightenment I can get from anyone would be most welcome. John
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| Posted: Sun Aug 9th, 2009 06:00 pm |
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13th Post |
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kdog Fellow, Academy of Sublime Masters of Appliantology
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TramoreJohn wrote:
In both cases, this indicates a failed lid switch, first is failed in open position (water fill only)- second is failed in closed position (spin only). No further tests need to be made, especially live, lid switch assembly - RepairClinic part #1468 Last edited on Sun Aug 9th, 2009 06:19 pm by kdog ____________________ Can Ye spare some 'cutter me brutha ? http://web.me.com/zenzoidman/kdog/ |
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| Posted: Sun Aug 9th, 2009 06:26 pm |
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14th Post |
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RegUS_PatOff Fellow, Academy of Sublime Masters of Appliantology
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(... why did you remove wires to check for voltage ?) Replace Fuse here a test: FOR TESTING ONLY: disconnect Black, Red, and Yellow wires from Lid Switches Connect together & tape those wires Machine should run with Lid open or closed Last edited on Sun Aug 9th, 2009 06:31 pm by RegUS_PatOff ____________________ RegUS_PatOff http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oPAY2LsKVEw my video production: “Easter Seals Walk With Me” (also in HQ) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-EBiLyYXMiA Upon leaving this Earth "Do you want the Smoking or Non-Smoking section ?" |
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| Posted: Sun Aug 9th, 2009 06:57 pm |
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15th Post |
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kdog Fellow, Academy of Sublime Masters of Appliantology
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Get the switch ordered up
____________________ Can Ye spare some 'cutter me brutha ? http://web.me.com/zenzoidman/kdog/ |
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| Posted: Sun Aug 9th, 2009 09:12 pm |
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16th Post |
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TramoreJohn Apprentice Appliantologist, First Class
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kdog, Thanks for the detailed explaination of the lid switch failure. That is just the kind of specific detailed info I need as I am not at all experienced in this. I just ordered the part. Its due here on Wed so hopefully by Thursday I'll be able to report back that all is well. RegUS_PatOff, Thanks again for your help, too. I greatly appreciate all the interest from everyone. I removed the leads because I am a rank amatuer. I assumed I needed to test all three leads and that they should be unattached to the switch. The white lead has a plastic shield so I removed it so I could probe into the lead. That's when I blew the fuse. Of course if that lead is always hot that explains why it has an insulator..... I've sprung for the $40 (incl shipping) for a new switch assembly vice trying the additional test you suggest. If the switch does not solve the problem, should I try the test you recommend (taping all the red, black and yellow lid switch wires together)? John
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| Posted: Sun Aug 9th, 2009 09:52 pm |
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17th Post |
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RegUS_PatOff Fellow, Academy of Sublime Masters of Appliantology
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TramoreJohn wrote: ... If the switch does not solve the problem, should I try the test you recommend (taping all the red, black and yellow lid switch wires together)? no ... that test would by-pass the bad Lid Switch, but since you'll have a good Lid Switch, the test won't be needed needed ..
____________________ RegUS_PatOff http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oPAY2LsKVEw my video production: “Easter Seals Walk With Me” (also in HQ) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-EBiLyYXMiA Upon leaving this Earth "Do you want the Smoking or Non-Smoking section ?" |
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| Posted: Thu Aug 13th, 2009 12:33 am |
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18th Post |
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TramoreJohn Apprentice Appliantologist, First Class
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No luck with the new lid switch assembly. Well, actually a partial improvement but I still can't wash clothes. So I got the part today (Great 2-day shipping, folks!) but it did not solve the problem. The machine will now fill with water and agitate but that is it. The switch appears to be working as the machine will stop agitating when I lift the lid and start again when I lower it. And when I first installed it the machine would do nothing but when I raised the lid I could hear the out of balance switch click and it worked when I lowered the lid. So I believe all parts of the lid switch assembly are working properly. The timer knob does move on its own to the agitate phase after the drum fills. But once the timer knob moves past agitate, all I get is a loud and nasty electronic hum. I believe the knob continues to rotate but it sounded so bad I did not want to let it go for long so I am not sure. This sounds just like the same hum I got after I blew the lid switch fuse in my earlier troublshooting. When I manually move the knob along the cycle it won't try to spin with water in the drum. Of course I wouldn't expect it to try to spin in this case. I tried two different types of cycles, normal and delicate, and got the same behavior. So I emptied the drum and set the knob to spin. Same thing - only a hum. I then put it on rinse and it filled with water and agitated. But again when it was time to empty the water and spin it just hummed. I opened the control panel and could see the timer motor whirring around in a circle while it was humming. So as it stands now I can fill the washer and agitate the clothes but nothing else. Again, I seek enlightenment. And now the pressure is on as the weekend is looming up ahead with an ever filling hamper of dirty clothes.... I'd sure appreciate any ideas. John
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| Posted: Thu Aug 13th, 2009 01:27 am |
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19th Post |
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RegUS_PatOff Fellow, Academy of Sublime Masters of Appliantology
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If you could measure the voltages at the Motor while it's trying to Spin in the Permanant Press Cycle: Red to Brown = 120v AC Black to White = 120v AC
____________________ RegUS_PatOff http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oPAY2LsKVEw my video production: “Easter Seals Walk With Me” (also in HQ) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-EBiLyYXMiA Upon leaving this Earth "Do you want the Smoking or Non-Smoking section ?" |
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| Posted: Thu Aug 13th, 2009 02:06 am |
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20th Post |
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TramoreJohn Apprentice Appliantologist, First Class
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RegUS_PatOff, Thanks for the reply. I have to admit to you that I am clueless on how to do this. Are you speaking of the motor that runs the agitator or the timer motor? In either case I'm not sure how to access the leads. For example, on the timer motor all the leads come in on large block connectors. How do I access them while they are connected? I don't see a repair manual for my washer on this site so I don't have any good pictures or diagrams (other than the wiring diagram that comes with the washer) for reference. I have already proven my capacity to blow things up by blowing the fuse, so I really am not confident to do this without rather explicit directions. BTW, is it possible that when I blew the fuse I also damaged the Timer Motor? John
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