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Tamerlane
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Posted: Sun Jun 29th, 2008 06:30 |
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My Kenmore 75062 window unit (a rebadged LG GL6000ER) cools the room well enough to 70F or below in 95F+ weather, but does not dehumidify at all, according to 3 hygrometers I have as well as the obvious damp cellar-like feel of the room. 70 degrees humidity outside, 65-70 inside.
The A/C is located in a moderately sized room of 15'x15'. It seems well installed with a slight downward angle outside and almost no air leakage. The unit is not that old so I would be surprised if anything has clogged up yet. Any help or advice is appreciated.
Last edited on Sun Jun 29th, 2008 07:16 by Tamerlane
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RegUS_PatOff
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Posted: Sun Jun 29th, 2008 16:25 |
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I'm not an expert, but a few faq's:
The temperature in a room using an air conditioner will not drop until the humidity drops. (the cooling removes the humidity first)
Make sure the water drain tube is clear and draining the water out of the bottom of the unit.
Hygrometers read relative humidity.Last edited on Sun Jun 29th, 2008 16:27 by RegUS_PatOff
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Tamerlane
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Posted: Sun Jun 29th, 2008 19:45 |
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Thanks. Water drainage looks fine. I can't comment on the general relationship between cooling and dehumidifying. I can say that the outside temperature is 90-95F and measures 70-75% humidity, while the inside temperature is a pleasant 70F and unpleasant 70% humidity. Also, the previous window air conditioner in the same room, and the air conditioner in another room of the same apartment, have all reduced the temperature while reducing the humidity. For example, another room currently cooled by a different A/C unit measures 45% humidity.
I guess I am wondering if it's even possible for the dehumidification process to break while the cooling function still works? The specs for this model claim "Dehumidification: 38.0 Pts./24 Hrs" but I just can't believe this is happening.
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Cactus Bob
Sublime Master of Appliantology
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Posted: Sun Jun 29th, 2008 19:50 |
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cannot look up your unit , have nothing on LG but i am in HVAC so i might be able to help , so lets go : i need the BTUs of the unit ---- i need the state or the country you are in ---- i need to know the # of windows in the room and the # of doors and does the door go to the outside or into another cooled space ? -------one more thing is there water splashing around in the rear of the ac ( dont panic this is normal and helpes cool the unit , most water should be staying in the unit,if not you may have it slanted to much )
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Tamerlane
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Posted: Sun Jun 29th, 2008 20:15 |
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Thanks, here is the info: 6000BTU in a room under 15'x15', in Toronto, Ontario, Canada. 1 window in the room and 1 door which goes into another cooled space (kept at slightly higher temperature by a different A/C but a much less humid 45%).
Window installation has a virtual air seal so only air lost is through the gap under the one door and when the door is opened very briefly 5-6 times per day. The compressor is coming on every 3 mins or so as it should when hot outside and is cooling the room to temp. setting but with absolutely no sign of dehumidification (as I say, room is 70% humidity measured on 3 hygrometers versus 45% in adjacent room).
No sloshing noise from the Kenmore/LG A/C, no audible spatter of fan hitting water, no dripping that I hear. When I look through the parts of the A/C housing there is very little and sometimes no water sitting in the bottom tray. This model has no drain hole/tube at the back or underneath the unit. Water would have to collect 1.5" or so above the rear lip of the frame to pour over, but I don't think it has ever done this. My level shows the unit is only very barely tilted outwards.Last edited on Sun Jun 29th, 2008 20:19 by Tamerlane
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RegUS_PatOff
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Posted: Sun Jun 29th, 2008 20:27 |
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Tamerlane wrote: ... another room currently cooled by a different A/C unit measures 45% humidity...
at the same room temperature ? it's probably warmer in the other (45%) room
humidity is relative humidity, if you were to put the hygrometer directly in the air coming out of at the Evaporator Coils, it would read 100% RH (but at a low temperature)
Last edited on Sun Jun 29th, 2008 20:44 by RegUS_PatOff
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Tamerlane
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Posted: Sun Jun 29th, 2008 20:44 |
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I may not understand the relationship between temperature and relative humidity, as I say. Again here is the data:
Bedroom with LG/Kenmore A/C
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70F A/C temperature setting
70F thermometer temp. readings
65-70% hygrometer humidity readings
Adjacent living room with Whirlpool A/C
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73F-74F A/C temperature setting
73F-74F thermometer temp. readings
45% hygrometer humidity readings
Comparing apples to apples, if I set the bedroom LG/Kenmore to 73F as well the bedroom will adjust to 73F on its own cooling, but the room stays damp and hygrometers still read ~65%+ humidity, at least when the doors are closed. And no matter which instrument shows what measurement, the bedroom feels obviously damper no matter what the temperature setting is. Of course I can shut off the Kenmore/LG and let the air circulate from the adjacent room, so that the bedroom gets dryer. But then the bedroom gets too hot -- hotter than the adjacent room cooled by the Whirlpool which cannot produce enough cooling and air flow to get into the bedroom.
Last edited on Sun Jun 29th, 2008 20:53 by Tamerlane
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RegUS_PatOff
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Posted: Sun Jun 29th, 2008 20:52 |
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Tamerlane wrote: ... if I set the bedroom LG/Kenmore to 73F the room will adjust to 73F on its own cooling like the adjacent room, but the hygrometers will still read 65%+ humidity (at least when the doors are closed)... try it
70% RH at 70F (indoors) is holding about half the moisture as 70% RH at 90F (outdoors)
Last edited on Sun Jun 29th, 2008 20:53 by RegUS_PatOff
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Tamerlane
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Posted: Sun Jun 29th, 2008 20:57 |
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I don't understand: I did try it. When the LG/Kenmore is set to 73F the bedroom humidity measurements remain high and so does the actual feeling of dampness. Walking from the living room at 73F cooled by the Whirlpool into the bedroom at 73F cooled by the LG/Kenmore feels like descending into the cellar.
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Cactus Bob
Sublime Master of Appliantology
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Posted: Sun Jun 29th, 2008 21:11 |
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does the fan keep running when the compressor turns off , is there a switch that you can set to turn off everthing with the thermostat ? the reason is when the compressor turns off and the fan runs any water on the cooling coils goes right back into the room air ...... because todays ac units are more efecant ( see note about spelling!) your air is colder than your old unit and it runs less ...... you should have bought a 4000 btu unit for that room ..... run a lot -lower cool- removes more moisture 
Last edited on Sun Jun 29th, 2008 21:26 by Cactus Bob
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Tamerlane
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Posted: Sun Jun 29th, 2008 21:27 |
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Now that you mention it, standard 'cool' setting does keep the fan on all the time. I do keep the fan on lowest setting but maybe this still has an effect. Looking at the manual, there is an 'energy saving' setting that turns the fan off when the compressor turns off. I can try that.
As for 4000BTU, yes, maybe that would have helped. The thing is the two previous A/C models I had in the same room were 7000BTU and both kept humidity down far better than this one.
I would really like to know: (1) if it's even *possible* that my unit is broken in some way, which would explain the very limited dehumidification despite effective cooling, or (2) if my unit is definitely functioning as it should in every way (since it is cooling) but this particular overpriced 'high efficiency' 10.7 EER model just does not remove nearly as much moisture as the 4 other models I have owned over the years. #2 seems strange to me given the specification of 38.0 Pts./24 Hrs dehumidification but who knows...
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RegUS_PatOff
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Posted: Sun Jun 29th, 2008 21:31 |
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air conditioning can't lower the temperature untill the humidity drops.
are you using the same thermometer and hygrometer to take the readings in each room ?
thermometer and hygrometer together in the same location
unless the two rooms are much different, and the one had a higher amount of humidity than the other room to start with.
cement floor, lots of items that would hold the humidity for a while, carpeting furniture, different walls, windows, ect...
Last edited on Mon Jun 30th, 2008 01:25 by RegUS_PatOff
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Cactus Bob
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Posted: Mon Jun 30th, 2008 01:50 |
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" air conditioning can't lower the temperature untill the humidity drops" ....SORRY BUT THATS NOT TRUE in 1979 my first house i was 19 & stupid ..... my house was 950 SQ FT i got a 5 ton heat pump for free so i installed it ..... it was HORRIBULL ! and still is ( i now rent the house ) WET WET WET AND COLD runs for ten mins and off for an hour . i have said when it dies it gets a 2 ton , and it never dies !
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Tamerlane
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Posted: Mon Jun 30th, 2008 02:04 |
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Yes, same 3 instruments, each measuring temperature and humidity, and all of them providing measurements very close to one another.
I'm not denying that the bedroom unit lowers the room humidity to some extent (relative to the outside air), even though it doesn't feel like it, but it leaves the humidity in the room abnormally high at 65-70%. Is that normal? As I say, I have used other models in the same very same room and window that remove more moisture. Not surprising since the specs on moisture removal of different units seem to differ greatly. This particular LG/Kenmore model claims 38.0 Pts./24 Hrs but leaves our bedroom feeling very damp and clammy and measures high humidity.
So my question is: is an A/C that cools effectively but leaves you with 70% humidity a broken unit or a crummy model?
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RegUS_PatOff
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Posted: Mon Jun 30th, 2008 03:15 |
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Cactus Bob is correct, if the unit is sized too big for the room (or house) it won't run long enough to reduce the humidity effectively.
A smaller unit running for a longer time is better.
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Tamerlane
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Posted: Wed Jul 2nd, 2008 19:43 |
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Cactus Bob wrote: does the fan keep running when the compressor turns off , is there a switch that you can set to turn off everthing with the thermostat ? the reason is when the compressor turns off and the fan runs any water on the cooling coils goes right back into the room air
I can now confirm that 'energy saving' mode which turns the fan off with the compressor seems to reduce humidity somewhat (-10%+ at same temperatures). Progress! It's still the least dehumidifying A/C I've ever owned.
Would it help some more if I made a drain hole so that there is never any standing water for the fan to kick up or blow onto the coils (remember there is no drain on this model)?
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Cactus Bob
Sublime Master of Appliantology
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Posted: Thu Jul 3rd, 2008 06:28 |
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PLEASE , PLEASE ! DONT MAKE CHANGES TO YOUR UNIT the water is there to help cool the unit . at min removeing the water will reduce the life of the compressor . at max you will drill right through a freon line ( i see and fix one a year ! ) SO DONT DO IT , DONT EVEN THINK ABOUT IT , PLEASE ! ! you ac unit is a good one , and it uses little power for the cooling you get . its just does not remove enough moisture for your taste , and there is nothing you can do about it ...... unless you want to go shopping for another one a smaller one this time i hope GOOD LUCK
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TOPPS Appliance Service
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Posted: Sun Aug 31st, 2008 17:39 |
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Have to agree "strongly" with cactus on the oversizing.
You can get pretty close by using 500sqf = 10,000btu/h for window units, but in no way will take the place of a proper heat loss-calc [manual j] for split systems.
I see this common mistake everyday with contractors in my area!
Either they don't use one at all [manual J], or they ignore a scenerio of HO upgrading windows, doors, insulation ect... which now leaves the HO with an oversized system and can't figure out why the unit they had installed a year ago may have a harder time getting their home comfortable after $$$$ amount later. 
Sorry, didn't mean to hijack! Just enjoy seeing people giving good foresight. Far cry from my parts!
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